Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

John Thomas8
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Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

Post #1 by John Thomas8 » August 2nd, 2013, 3:47 pm

Before there was Jamestown and even before there was Roanoke, there was Spain's Fort San Juan, in the Appalachian foothills of North Carolina.

Archaeologists have uncovered the remains of the fort built by gold-hunting Spanish conquistadors in the 16th century and say it's the oldest European garrison ever found in the interior of the United States.

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The Oracle
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Re: Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

Post #2 by The Oracle » August 5th, 2013, 2:29 pm

I knew...... ?(

My great-g-g-g-g-g-g-g-g-g :mrgreen: -g-g-g-g-gg-g-g-grandfather , the Moor packbearer slave-type dude....snuck away and consorted with my Creek Indian grandmother. At least according to the genetic test done on my sister. Where they lived in the hills of what would become NC/Tenn, happily for hundreds of years before the pox carrying English dogs came with their petulance. According to historical tales; the Moors of Spain were happy to go away to America. To escape the Spanish Inquisition. Where Spain purged itself of the Moors; one way or the other.

Exactly from there. A fair number of pack-bearers as well as disenchanted Conquistadors did the same thing.

They didn't find gold. But they weren't far off either. The NC gold deposits were close.

John Thomas8
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Re: Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

Post #3 by John Thomas8 » August 5th, 2013, 6:23 pm

History shows that all Europeans dragged disease over here and killed a bunch o' the natives.

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The Oracle
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Re: Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

Post #4 by The Oracle » August 6th, 2013, 2:30 pm

There was some suggestion that the early Spanish interaction may have indeed killed many. The Cherokee are supposed to have moved into lands abandoned by the Creek. The Creek moving away from the whites. Both Creek and Cherokee survivors mixed with the invaders. And those descendants, including mixed race Mulungeons had greater resistance to the onslaught of disease brought by the northern Europeans afterwards.

Escaped blacks later mixed with the tribes. Adding another genetic mix to the central Appalachian Mulungeon.

The early Spanish expedition was somewhat different. The long journey of a relatively small band started in Florida. That's a long way on trails for disease to follow. It wasn't the wam bam the English delivered up and down the east coast.

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Bill Bryan
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Re: Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

Post #5 by Bill Bryan » August 11th, 2013, 11:04 am

Y'all have to read 1491 and 1493, by Charles C. Mann. Just a suggestion. About what the Western Hemisphere was like before Columbus, and the immediate aftermath. Spooky, spooky books, but there's been a ton of new research since we were kids.

The diseases from the Spanish wiped out 80% of the population of South America long before those diseases spread north, and long before the Spanish even discovered places like the Inca empire. By the time Pizarro got to Peru, most of the population was already dead.

Many more descriptions like that in the books. Before the Europeans came, there weren't huge herds of bison roaming the Great Plains. An early explorer on the Mississippi reported huge populations of Amerindians, but no big bison herds. Fifty years later the Amerindians were gone and there were literally millions of bison, like a disease vector on the land.

Awesome books. I recommend them both highly.

But Ft. San Juan is new to me, and a very cool new discovery.
"My presidency is entering the fourth quarter. Interesting stuff happens in the fourth quarter."
- President Barack Obama

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The Oracle
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Re: Who Knew: Ft. San Juan

Post #6 by The Oracle » August 12th, 2013, 7:52 am

As an aside....... did you all see that the "Lost Colony" has been found?

The Carolina coastline was a battleground; if you could call it that. Spaniards came up the Cape Fear and sacked Brunswick Town twice. The English moved further up the river and established Wilmington. Which was two tides up the river instead of one.

Then... :mrgreen: the English sacked the town during the Revolution. That was it for Brunswick Town.

Poor ol' town just couldn't get a break.

The English at Fort Raleigh actually moved further into the Albermarle Sound near present day Edenton. But on the other side of the sound. It wasn't as much "lost" as it was hidden on maps of the era. To prevent the Spanish from sacking it.


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